Hello Paul,
A few points that some of us believe should be addressed before a contract is decided upon. We consider these to be very important.
1. Is the drawing to scale? The developer said yes but that is not good enough. We need to be sure that the commission and the public see an accurate drawing before the commission is asked to make a decision.
2. The elevations of the building need to be written into the contract. "Two stories" stated verbally is not sufficient. How many feet in elevation?
3. I have sent a request to Wes, asking for clarification about the possible implications of a zoning change, specifically whether a hotel could then be built on the beach. Please make sure that this is addressed before a zoning change contingency is written into the contract.
Thank you,
Laurie Decker
Annabeth KarsonHello Wes,
After the beach negotiation meeting today, a concern is being raised that a change in zoning could allow a hotel to be built on our beach. Please address the possible zoning changes that could allow this to happen. I hope you will agree that this needs to be discussed before a zoning change contingency is included in the contract with the developer.
Wes, please address the possibility of the developer building a hotel on our beach from the zoning perspective.
Thank you.
Annabeth Karson
Laurie Decker
Well, if we were to craft language that allowed hotels on the beach, that would be possible. Technically speaking. That would probably entail a land use plan change (reviewed by the State of Florida and also would entail a major change to our zoning regulations). I cringe at the thought. The concept of residential (I place hotels as a quasi-residential use) was completely ruled out after the last (circa 1998+ or -) attempt. It just would not happen politically (a prediction with 99.9% assurance) and I am sure that Palm Beach would have something to say about it too. And, nothing that happened today would indicate that was a possibility.
No one in their right mind, and I include myself in that group (please back me up on this!), would allow that to happen. Perhaps that is why nothing has been changed related to zoning on the beach in that the fear of such a prospect prevents any action that would allow something that we would actually want on the beach.
A cold day in H-E-double toothpicks comes to mind...
I repeat...nothing happened today that would indicate that was even a remote possibility.
Wes Blackman
When we as a City create a list of permitted uses for the beach, it could exclude hotels by not listing them as permitted uses. Also, there are many hotels in the area that don't have adequate ballroom facilities and may want to supplement their offerings with an off-site location such as a ballroom at the beach. It may also provide opportunities for revenue sharing with the City if the revenue gained from such a venue is beyond a certain amount.
Anything proposed there would have to meet the Countywide traffic performance standards - meaning a traffic study would have to be reviewed and approved by Palm Beach County. Again, the hours of operation would be looked at as it related to peak hour traffic and the projected peak hour demand for such a facility.
There have been many times that I have been a part of large Lake Worth related events that had to be held in West Palm Beach or unincorporated Palm Beach County since the City didn't have access or its own facilities to accommodate such numbers. The City could strike a deal for priority scheduling for events, etc. It really is not that far out as you may think.
If the primary source of traffic is "off island", I don't see Palm Beach having a great concern over the use of such a facility.
I think if you contemplate this a while, the prospect will seem more within the realm of the possible, without many harsh impacts.
We can discuss this more and I am sure we will, as a community, before it would come to pass. In the process, we would identify areas that might need additional controls. Please realize that we can only allow a hotel to built by including it as a permitted use or a conditional use. If it isn't there, no hotel.
I'd appreciate knowing your thoughts once you think about the prospect for a while.
Wes BlackmanThanks for replying . . .Also, there are many hotels in the area that don't have adequate ballroom facilities and may want to supplement their offerings with an off-site location such as a ballroom at the beach. It may also provide opportunities for revenue sharing with the City if the revenue gained from such a venue is beyond a certain amount.We know this, Denise has researched it. But it's my understanding that the city is not asking for revenue sharing, only $500,000. I think this is a huge mistake that we'll regret for two decades, if this project comes to fruition.LDI also think that we aren't asking for much in return for use of the beach. And, there didn't seem to be any support from the negotiating team for any kind of escalating clause over time, which amazed me. (Ed note: There is a max CPIU increase of up to 5% after the first year)
WesAre you only amazed?? I'm on the verge of apoplexy, to quote Howard Cosell.What on earth are they thinking?? Do you think we're going to walk away from millions? Could we (THEY) possibly be that desperate for a building?
I happen to live in the out-skirts of Apoplexy, a large and thriving metropolis within my being. Perhaps exposure has diluted its affect over time. LOL - where did that come from?
I do not understand the mind set of those that represent our fair City. Somehow, we always must have our hat in our hand, two cents in our pocket and are pressed to the wall for last minute decisions. Plus, we never adequately realize the assets that we posses that others would either only dream of or beg for. To hear Paul Boyer talk today, he was interested in just getting one check for one amount ($500,000) and not looking for complications, like formulas or revenue sharing clauses.
You would be hard pressed to find a municipality with 18 acres of property with essentially dual water frontage, in Florida or the east coast, period. We should be in the cat bird's seat, but we are just looking for table scraps. And to think this is a 30 + year odyssey further perplexes the already perplexed.Are you planning to mention these issues to Paul or the attorney? Or Corey? Or to ask them what their rationale is for being so poverty-minded?I hope to have the opportunity. (I did bring this up during the second day of discussions)
WesAnd if you know about the potential overflow of events from the area hotels, you should also know the prices they charge for venues that don't open onto the Atlantic.Denise has claculated a conservative estimate of revenues that a ballroom that size could generate and it's huge.Of course, we probably won't make them show us their financials for the next twenty years, so they can continue to mislead us about how much they're making. Not our business, right? Don't ask for too much or they might walk away from the sweetest deal that ever fell into their laps.And as developers go, they don't seem to be too crafty. It's terribly embarrassing that they're besting us at the negotiation table.Hi Wes,Thanks for the quick response. I appreciate your opinion that the political will to allow a hotel on the beach does not exist at this time. However our question was about the zoning. You write that allowing a hotel would entail "major" changes to the zoning. Would these major changes necessarily be more "major" than needed to allow the current beach proposal?The rest of the beach has hotels or condo buildings on it, so why would the State of Florida not approve the change? And why would Palm Beach have anything to say, especially considering their beach has hotels as well?With the wrong city commission, we can never be sure that the concept of a hotel could not come back. I thought the concept of a 50,000 sq ft structure on the beach was also completely ruled out after the "last attempt". So much for that.Does a hotel require the same zoning as residential? (Can you build a hotel in a multi-family neighborhood?) Or does a hotel require commercial designation?I am glad to know that the idea makes you cringe. Our question, however, is about the zoning:Would the zoning changes that would allow for the current beach proposal also allow for a hotel on the beach?Hope this can be answered with something akin to a yes or no, and why.Thanks again.AnnabethWould the zoning changes that would allow for the current beach proposal also allow for a hotel on the beach?NOWould these major changes necessarily be more "major" than needed to allow the current beach proposal?YES
The rest of the beach has hotels or condo buildings on it, so why would the State of Florida not approve the change?Because they would require an analysis regarding the need for essentially converting our "Preservation, Recreation and Open Space" district into a quasi commercial/residential zoning district that would require a modification to the future land use designation which underlies the property. It would be perceived that we are taking out land that was predominantly used for public recreational purposes and initiating a change which would allow a substantial (not ancillary) quasi-commercial use. I am not saying that this is impossible - the sun "could" rise in the West tomorrow, but the probability of that is extremely remote. I consider such a notion (allowing hotel uses on the beach) in that category. They may also have issues regarding the intensification of development allowed on the beach which is in a coastal high hazard area.
As with any question like this, this is an opinion of what is possible or probable. It is only my opinion and much of my opinion is also based upon on what I see and perceive as the public and political will not to have a hotel at our beach.Does a hotel require the same zoning as residential? (Can you build a hotel in a multi-family neighborhood?) Or does a hotel require commercial designation?Hotels are treated in both ways in terms of what zoning districts in which they are allowed. There are what I refer as quasi-commercial uses, but also have a multi-family residential quality to them. Many times they would be permitted through a permitted by "special use " approval, which involves meeting a higher standard(s) than other uses permitted by right within the same zoning district. I could walk you through our zoning regulations and show you how hotels/motels are regulated in both our commercial and multi-family residential districts if you want.
I thought the concept of a 50,000 sq ft structure on the beach was also completely ruled out after the "last attempt".There are currently no regulations within our PROS zoning district that allow for any use other than open air recreational uses. In order to accommodate anything different out there than what is there we need to establish regulations that deal with the proportion of the site that can be covered by impermeable surface (ground coverage) and by building (building coverage), setbacks, proportion of the site that can dedicated to any use other than recreational use, etc. If this has been a twinkle in the eyes of Lake Worth for over 30 years, you would think that somewhere along the line these changes would have been made to the zoning regulations that relate to this property. The fact that those changes haven't been made tell a lot about the difficulty of doing anything there - politically - than what is there now.
Again, my opinion.
Wes BlackmanThere should be a whole series of reporting requirements (audited financials) that could be used as a basis for revenue sharing. Also, part of our sharing should be an almost "right of first refusal" on the use of those facilities. We should take the stand that this is essentially ours, but when we are not using it, other people can use it.
I will mention this, but as moderator it is a bit out of an impartial and functional role.
Wes
Thank you for all the comments. The clarification is appreciated.
Annabeth
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